Virginia Law, Abortion, Expectant Mothers and Medical Professionals
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41 responses to “Virginia Law, Abortion, Expectant Mothers and Medical Professionals”
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You seem to have faith that Virginia will not pass law like Texas and a few other states that seeks to criminalize every potential contributor to the abortion process, not just physicians. We’ve seen Virginia legislators offer legislation patterned on other states before. We know we have some legislators who will push the envelope as far as possible and that this is a very hot button issue.
You must also believe that the rules governing who is recognized as actually raped or that the mother’s life is in danger, etc. will be reasonable and not result in effective abortion prohibition. If physicians fear for their licenses, they are likely to be unwilling to risk providing normal health care to pregnant women, to assure they don’t lose their license over someone’s (mis)interpretation of their actions. The threat of a costly and protracted battle to defend themselves many result in physicians and facilities deciding that they will no longer provide the service.
Already many areas of Virginia do not have adequate providers for pregnancy care. Many rural women have to travel long distances to deliver babies because insurance and other costs for physicians make it impossible for them to meet the needs locally.
I don’t think the dangers are as benign as you do.
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I comment only on what Steve Newman has said. Three reasons:
– I know Sen. Newman and take him at his word.
– If the law penalizes the woman getting an abortion, many Republicans would vote against it.
– It also is the only way such a law, even if passed and signed, would have any chance of surviving a shift in the power in Richmond.So we’ll see.
Though constantly changing abortion laws may be the future in Virginia, polls show that a steady majority of Virginians will support a 15- or 20-week option that punishes only the providers.
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But your words offer assurances based upon your trust of a politician’s statements. You wish all to believe your opinion based upon hearsay. Sounds more like: Don’t look here, look over there.” Too many have been down that road, especially with Republicans, too often. Try again when the first trial balloons float.
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This is why I say the GOP Moderates who “tut tut” are whistling in the wind with regard to the intentions of their ideological brethren to their right – and I suspect they know it and wringing hands and folded arms will be their response to more ideological idiocy.
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The issue is that as soon as the Republicans get control of the Senate in addition to the House, they will try to ban abortion or maybe six week heartbeat bill with a poison pill provision to discourage all abortions.
Also, focusing on criminal and civil threats to Ob/Gyns will discourage those physicians from practicing in Virginia.-
I doubt it. While there is already a proposal for a “life begins at conception” bill I don’t think it will get the universal support of Republicans required to pass even if the Republicans take back control of the state senate.
Beyond that, a federal law is more likely to come up before the state elections of 2023. Biden is already talking about dropping the filibuster rule to codify abortion law.
Biden’s Build Back Better idea was essentially stopped by two Democratic senators. I imagine that there will be several Republican politicians in Virginia that won’t buy into the “life begins at conception” theory. Even today Youngkin is talking about 15 or 20 weeks.
http://thebullelephant.com/virginia-senator-hackworth-to-patron-life-begins-at-conception-bill/
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A federal law will not happen until 2025 when the Republican swill probably control the U.S. House, the U.S. Senate, and the White House. Then the filibuster ends and abortion will be outlawed along with most forms of birth control. The Republicans will stir up Sodomy laws or gay marriage to cause progressives to lose focus.
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And plagues of locusts.
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Roe plus Jan 6 May hold surprises for the pundits echoing a Republican tidal wave in 2022. It ain’t over till the fat lady sings.
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See my response to Moderate above.
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Republicans have not feared losing votes in many states led by Texas in criminalizing women undergoing an abortion. Since VA’s law has not yet been written, reliance upon the opinion of a non-legislator is speculation. For sure, that law, whatever it turns out to be, cannot at this juncture be mischaracterized. At the same time, criminal penalties or license threats directed at physicians are certain to heighten fears related to the abortion decision process. Malpractice insurance premiums will rise. Assurances from a lay observer on the law “actually being developed” with respect to its provisions not in actuality is an unconvincing crystal ball prospect
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Once again, the left ignores the fact that Obama in 2009 could have easily obtained legislation that protected access to abortion, which would have been filibuster-proof ever since, and which would have most certainly been reviewed by the Supreme Court with a different make-up than today’s court. Sometimes Sacred Cows are very smart public officials who, by nature of his parents, cannot be criticized whatsoever by the left and its lackies the MSM.
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I’ve heard plenty of criticism of the left by the left for not doing more in the past and now. Not sure why you think that isn’t happening, other than this imagined idea that Barack Obama can’t be criticized because he’s Black (at least that’s what I think you’re getting at). People on the left criticize him all of the time. Maybe you’re not exposing yourself to enough “MSM.”
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Continual regret about an Obama “shoulda” was then. This is now with theological ideologues behind anti-abortion measures. The Roe and two recent rulings on religious freedom are mirror images of a single jurisprudence. BTW, the possibility of Obama’s success is not a fact but a mere opinion. It’s a dead horse.
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I’ve heard plenty of criticism of the left by the left for not doing more in the past and now. Not sure why you think that isn’t happening, other than this imagined idea that Barack Obama can’t be criticized because he’s Black (at least that’s what I think you’re getting at). People on the left criticize him all of the time. Maybe you’re not exposing yourself to enough “MSM.”
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With the Supreme Court’s boundaries off the table, all things are possible in Virginia. What might have passed two years ago will not define what happens now. Once there were many in the Republican Caucus who sought compromise and moderation on the issue. Not possible to survive a primary with that position now, probably. Will they fall on their swords and risk electoral defeat on this issue? Unlikely. Six week bill in particular very possible.
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Bob’s back with his Magic Wand?
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Won’t stop the theological ideologues from attempting it.
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See my response to Moderate above. If the Republicans go farther than Sen. Newman’s comments, I predict they will lose both the bill and their majority in the House. And should.
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Dobbs will result in State Politicians actually being held to account for their votes. They are no longer meaningless on the topic.
A Politician’s first goal is to remain in power, so the notion that the extremes on either side of the aisle are going to ram through anything is absurd.
The process by which we now must adhere is as it was designed. Bipartisan and moderate is the only way legislation will be passed.
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Seems easier to just let people who want an abortion get one, and those who don’t want one simply don’t get an abortion.
Less regulation on doctors, right?
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That is only true if the Commonwealth takes the position that the unborn child counts for nothing. No law, no regulation.
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Your point? You going to issue Social Security numbers and passports to the fetus? Do we change the definition of citizen to conceived in the US from born in the US… WAIT! Here’s your chance to stop anchor babies!
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Even wanted pregnancies sometimes have to be aborted for various reasons that are the business of a woman and her doctor. Giving rights to an “unborn child,” or a fetus as many of us like to call them, seems like an excellent example of government overreach. We don’t need the government regulating/interfering in the individual healthcare decisions of women. Moderate and James McCarthy, above, highlight some of the downsides of doing so, which, in my opinion, outweigh any moral arguments for why abortions shouldn’t happen at certain times in a pregnancy.
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“Giving rights to an “unborn child,” or a fetus as many of us like to call them, seems like an excellent example of government overreach. We don’t need the government regulating/interfering in the individual healthcare decisions of women.”
People call them fetuses to dehumanize them. It’s the same practice as calling enemies in war “Krauts” or whatever derogatory name you’d prefer.
He wasn’t suggesting giving them rights, but you’re argument only goes so far. There are always exceptions for abortion and that is between you and your Physician, however there has to be regulations on when.
Roe set for the guidelines that established it at viability for any reason (24 weeks). If you don’t know you’re pregnant by almost the 3rd trimester, you’ve got a lot more problems than pregnancy.
Dobbs made it so you can voice your opinion at the ballot box, the extremes will not win the day, so if you hold and extreme opinion. I’m sorry you’ll lose.
Edit: In addition, ultrasounds take place at 13 weeks to determine capability with life. They also complete genetic testing through blood at this point. There is an additional ultrasound between 18 and 22 weeks to determine if anatomy is correct.
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Wait until Texas demands pregnancy tests from women leaving for, and arriving from, Denmark and other European countries to assure they didn’t get things “fixed” while they were there.
Not the Republican way…
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But it can become the Texas Way.
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The old guys who are this blog don’t think that loss of control over one’s bodily functions is all that big of a deal… ya know, Depends…
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Despite the general lies from the MSM, most nations have abortion limits. See the link from WRAL-TV. https://www.wral.com/fact-check-biden-says-abortion-ruling-makes-u-s-an-outlier-among-developed-nations/20350123/
Unless one is open to live birth abortion like Delegate Tran, most people don’t go that far. What they will be is up to debate.
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Not a medical term.
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If you compare the other countries to what Republicans in this country are now in favor of and have passed in about 1/2 the states – they’re similar?
I’m conflicted by the issue but we need to be honest about the facts if we are to be able to have debates on the merits.
We are to believe that the moderate GOP is going to stand fast against the extreme GOP on abortion? Not so far.
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Please define “extreme GOP.”
I’ll define “”extreme Dem” – abortion on demand.
Now, is it “extreme” to contend that the clump of cells is a human being and deserves protection? (This is obviously rhetorical for all you Lefties as you were fine with violating the Nuremberg Code to mandate the experimental “vaccine,” so what’s the prob killing the defenseless clump of cells where a life was conceived?)
See, if you understood what the “life” crowd thinks, you wouldn’t call them extreme. I think they kinda have a point…
What happened to “safe, legal and rare?”
But things aren’t going to end just at the State level… Ultimately, I think there are pro-lifers who will keep going aiming for 14th Amendment protection for the fetus/clump of cells/baby.
In the sane world that pre-dated the sexual revolution and all the other maladies inflicted by the 60s radicals, there would have been a presumption of preserving innocent life…-
Do you think Europe and Asia policies with regard to abortion as ‘extreme”?
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Larry – I asked for YOUR definition.
I think the European laws represent a political compromise. This was taken away by the Supreme Court in a true act of judicial tyranny and poisoned the Courts, perhaps forever. Seriously, KBJ is a joke – she’s the first black woman and can’t tell what a woman is! All to protect a non-existent right.
So we lost 50 years of working out an understanding, and the baby-killers did themselves no favors by refusing to agree to any limits. The medical knowledge advances have turned many people’s minds. So, I foresee that this will not end anytime soon because there is a profound moral question about the “clump of cells” – is it a human? Does it have a soul? Does it deserve protection? Without Roe v Wade this might have been settled years ago…
Federalism is looking pretty good to me…
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The theology underlying Dobbs is,at once, an intrusion on freedom from and right to practice religion. Male domination of the debate relates to women as property. Enslaved pregnant women were property investments for enslavers as capital investment.
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Except most of those countries also offer guaranteed maternity leave and subsidized child care. So they have material support from the government to assist in raising their newborn.
The States, well, hope you live in the right place.
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Here’s what another source says:
“…it is key to understand that the Dobbs ruling not only allows state legislatures to limit women’s ability to get an abortion, but it also invites state legislatures to pass more laws that control pregnant women’s behavior… At least 40 states have used a variety of laws to punish the behavior of pregnant women over the last five decades… After Dobbs, as the dissenting judges explained, it seems the states have all the power they need to pass and enforce new laws that punish pregnant women, whether or not they want to get an abortion.”
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There is now a remedy for this, it’s called vote at the state level. Political engagement is supposed to begin at the state level, that was modified with the 17th Amendment.
Even better in some states you can get a ballot amendment for $3 million and some signatures and not even involve the legislature.
https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/chart-of-the-initiative-states.aspx
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1 in 50…
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2207423“An MFM specialist reported that their hospital no longer offers treatment for ectopic pregnancies implanted in cesarean scars, despite strong recommendations from the Society for Maternal–Fetal Medicine that these life-threatening pregnancies be definitively managed with surgical or medical treatment.”
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To have 8-year olds assemble Nike sneakers cheaper than the 12-year old Haitians, you first need a goodly supply of impoverished 8-year olds.
Ah, the good old days…
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1997-dec-14-mn-63852-story.html
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As an urban and rural park planner God was, according to those so inclined to believe, second to none, but as a plumber, he sucks!
Google “pregnancy what can go wrong” and be amazed.
1 in 50 pregnancies are ectopic, ~1 in 10 have deficient umbilical insertion, and then there are the whole host of defects with the fetus itself.These total bans already in place in half dozen States will kill your wives and daughters, or at least dent your bank accounts to fly them, if they can fly without dying midair, to a safe medical abortion.
Let me know if you need help with airline tickets. Air ambulances will require a second mortgage, but I’ll cut the interest rate as low as legal. Oh, Democrats only. Republicans, you’ve made your beds; you can make another daughter — if things go right.
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