Is It Time To Dust Off the Nixon – Ford Playbook?

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By DJ Rippert

Mea Culpa. I’ve long thought that’s it’s easier to get forgiveness than permission  So I’m going to join Jim Bacon and break the cardinal rule of Bacon’s Rebellion … sticking to topics limited to matters of Virginia public policy. Just this once.

Trump Gotta Go. By all accounts President Donald Trump is cocooned in the White House “mentally unreachable” to his staff and Vice President Pence. This would be unacceptable for two days let alone two weeks. America has many enemies and a mentally crippled president invites disaster. Beyond that, America has vast military might and a mentally crippled president could be tempted to use that might in ways that would be disastrous. Trump gotta go.

Exit doors. There are three exit doors that could be considered. The 25th Amendment, impeachment and resignation. I sincerely doubt that either of the first two are practical. Wikipedia provides a simple definition of the 25th Amendment. The 25th Amendment allows the vice president, together with a “majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide,” to declare the president “unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office” in a written declaration. So many of Trump’s “principal officers” have resigned or been fired that it’s a crap shoot what a majority of those who are left would choose to do. Unless we want to continue to shred the Constitution, impeachment requires that the president and his legal team have adequate time to prepare a defense. That leaves resignation.

The Pence plan. One suspects that even in a challenged mental state Donald Trump will look out for Donald Trump. A promise of a blanket pardon for all actions taken during his presidency would be compelling. Whether it’s exactly legal is a good question but back room deals get done all the time in Washington. The pardon would also be contingent on Trump never seeking political office again. Obviously, this plan would need to be proposed by Vice President Pence.

Additional benefits. Trump’s supporters would see a Trump resignation for exactly what it is — a cowardly compromise made to save his own skin. Who would march, fight or worse for such a person? A resignation effectively neuters Trump with his base. Once the resignation occurs, Vice President Pence could do whatever possible to make the Biden Administration transition less chaotic.

Blowback. Pence’s political career would be ruined much like Jerry Ford’s political future was ended by his pardon of Nixon. There would probably be protests, some violent, from those on the left who felt Trump got away with crimes. Those are the downsides. But Pence has already tainted himself and probably ought to consider a non-governmental position and the protests will subside as people forget about Donald Trump.

Goodbye and good riddance. The sooner Donald Trump disappears from the political scene the better. Years of dragging him through various lawsuits of debatable merit and possibly criminal trials would prove nothing. Moreover, it would make him a martyr to those in his base of support who have proven that they are willing to commit violence in his name.

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76 responses to “Is It Time To Dust Off the Nixon – Ford Playbook?

  1. Suitable for the WSJ… now.

    Damage’s done.

    • I guess we can all hold our breath for the next two weeks but if Iran decides this chaos provides an opportune moment to strike in retaliation for the killing of Soleimani the pardon will look very cheap in comparison. Or maybe Trump decides to go out with a “bang” so to speak. High stakes.

    • Ha. I just saw the WSJ article. I published my article just before 7:41. I honestly knew nothing of the WSJ article before I published this. Now, I’ve seen the article. Or, I saw the first part. I don’t subscribe and it’s behind a paywall. I know they are calling on him to resign but did they come up and say it would have to be a quid pro quo for a Pence pardon? If so, I guess great minds think alike. If not, they haven’t been paying attention lately.

      • I thought of the smooth transition in exchange for mercy weeks ago.

        Figured that for his angle. It’s not the pardon, it’s the agreement that Congress won’t challenge it in court and I’m betting some group of lawyrs is even in daily contact with the Manhattan DA for their signoff.

        I think he just queered the deal.

        • Before I retired, I had to research and write a legal memo on the legal effects of Presidential pardons. There is a line of Supreme Court cases that go back to the post-Civil War pardons of former Confederates and extend to modern times — the bottom line is that Presidential pardons are essentially untouchable by Congress and the federal courts, and any federal prosecutor trying to bring a criminal case by ignoring a Presidential pardon would have his or her case thrown out of court.

          I assume the legal precedents have not changed since I retired because a Supreme Court decision revising its precedents on pardons would have been a major national news story.

          • Has the issue of a president pardoning himself ever been addressed?

            I’m no lawyer but it seems to me the Supreme Court might draw the line at that action.

          • The Nixon, Cart Blanc, pardon was not challenged.

            Has any president issued a “the bearer has done what he has done and is pardoned for it”?

            A self-pardon will definitely be so. The OLC may have made a sitting president un-indictable, but no equal branch of government will allow the Constitution to make kings of them.

  2. This is good DJ! Well reasoned and argued. And I agree, no matter what happens, he will become a martyr and his personna will live on and on, cult-like.

    • Thank you. Mid term, we need to put this behind us. Short term, if Trump ordered the US Navy to attack the Iranian Navy – would they do it? I assume they would.

      My guess (and it’s only a guess) is that Trump has suffered what my parents used to call a nervous breakdown.

      • My guess is that the word is out and DOD and others have been told to verify all POTUS orders with Chief of Staff or similar. I’m suspecting some of this may have already happened.

        The theory is that this can’t happen. I think it can and is preferable by someto other alternatives – at least for a short time.

        In terms of nervous breakdown, We’ve been hearing outlandish things from him for years… and his public attacks on a long string of other people is not normal and it’s been his behavior from the get go.

        If you look at his rallies in terms of what he has said – really not that different from this last time to his supporters in DC. Was not that different from other rallies. Protestors were further emboldened by the GOP congressmen who would fight the certification on the very grounds Trump was arguing – conspiracy.

        This is not only Trump – many of his supporters are loony tunes also. Look at those photos of them inside the Capitol.

        • That would be illegal. I’d definitely want that on record because if the Dems are so high and mighty ethical, then it can be done to them by those not in power.

      • Nice dream, but we won’t get off that easy.

  3. Ripper. You are a [email protected]@@@ genius.

  4. 1) Biden didn’t show up thru the campaign time, lot longer than Trump will be able to. Biden is also in bed with China, and he’s made so many gaffes that millions consider him “mentally crippled”.
    Pelosi – like a woman who can get fooled by a hair dresser (as she claims) has access to military codes, what do you call?

    2) Grow up. Dems have tried this playbook for ages with no data, no research and no facts. Just temper tantrums. Dont like someone when you drink your own Kool Aid is not a reason to take down someone who could orchestrate multiple Middle Eastern Countries to join with Israel. How come Dems couldn’t do that? They can only run with totalitarian govts.

    3) 70-80M voters couldn’t give a flying fart what you think, Biden, Harris, Pelosi and the rest of those haven’t been able to accomplish diddly that helps. Look at Newsom in California. People leaving in droves, its a disaster. Same for Chicago, Baltimore, etc. See all those gun control laws haven’t done anything to stop the criminals has it?

    4) Virginia has been made worse off in business and tons of lives thru the mismanagement of the VDH and EO’s. When you show me a Democrat who knows how to truly look out for the people, can do foreign policy like a master, and doesn’t whine/blame/beef that everything is someone else’s fault, speaks the truth, spreads the word on the filth, let me know. I’m still waiting. That would also go for folks who can use facts not feelings, whines, blames, cries, attempts to bully, intimidate or criminally destroy someones’ property or life because they don’t get what they want.

    Stomping for power when all the riots/protests were going on that destroyed all sorts of places, Dems told Trump to piss off. They allowed CHAZ (among other things), so no, I’m not putting up with your hypocrisy and tantrum and first amendment violations (among many others).

    • Are you sure you are responding to my post? No disrespect intended … but if you are responding to my post I’m completely lost.

      • Typical. Can never see your own shortcomings and hypocrisy that has made folks leave the left.

        • V N – I’m not kidding or being sarcastic.

          My thesis –

          1. Donald Trump is experiencing some kind of mental challenge of late. He has been behaving more and more erratically since the election. Note: I have generally supported Trump over the past four years.

          2. Trump’s present issues (since the election) have made me question his fitness for even what’s left of his term.

          3. It would be in everybody’s best interest if, in return for a Pence pardon, President Trump quit two weeks before the end of his term.

          I said nothing about the past four years, nothing about Biden, nothing about CHAZ, etc.

          I voted for Trump.

          But he’s gone off the deep end. His aides (good conservatives all) are saying he’s in a mental cocoon. His inaction during the Capitol attack was the wake up call for me. I don’t think he incited a riot, I don’t think he wanted the violence. But he seemed to be in a daze through it all. Biden was right when he said Trump should get on live TV and tell his supporters to stop with the violence.

          A resignation and a pardon is the best for everyone right now.

          I hate to say it but the man appears to need help.

          • I actually do not think he is that different than before.

            What changed was that his latest speech to his supporters is believed to have incited them to go rampage the Capitol and that’s unacceptable to a whole bunch of folks including GOP Congressmen and members of his own administration.

            If the Capitol had not been ransacked, many would have said that Trump was just being Trump… very similar talk to his rally talks. A bunch of his supporters were encouraged to drive flagged truck and vehicles to several different cities to confront BLM folks. Right?

            Okay in Kenosha.. not so much at the Capitol.

            Now that he’s said a bad thing and people actually went berserk at the Capitol, and most of Congress is pissed off AND SAYING SO, time to dump him… it was good while it lasted but now………

          • Blow that smoke under someone else’s skirt. You have been fooled enough that you can’t think straight. Trump predicted they would do this.
            When people have been putting knives in his back, (look at yourself in the mirror) the party that doesn’t exist for most people except for Trump, I and any one else in America who is decent would never run again for Republicans. Never trust them.
            That goes for any one who takes off at the last minute like people are inventing to get rid of him.
            I didn’t vote for the guy in 2016. I never paid attention to POTUS Obama, nor Trump because I have no TV/radio. I did get things that filtered thru that were facts. Enough to know that you and others are an embarrassment to a man who did better than any Republican ever has for you all and you all backstabbed him.

            13 days? The lust for total power is such that 13 days you can’t wait? When no one else was blamed for CHAZ and all the other stuff, it was blamed on Trump, now that folks have had well enough of the fecal material and hypocrisy and lack of common sense, you blame him?

            Sorry DJ, you are like a few others on this blog: no longer worth reading.

      • kinda fun watching DJ being accused of being a leftist. 😉

        • I honestly didn’t think he was responding to my article. It sounded more like a comment on the Banana Republic article. As you know, the only two major politicians I disrespect more than Biden are Hillary and Ralph Northam.

          Trump scares me right now. I know it’s only two weeks but he’s being very erratic. Plus, he won’t do the Republican Party any net good after he leaves office anyway. If he keeps lurking around talking about a 2024 run he’ll become the Ross Perot of the Republican Party. Not popular enough to win but popular enough to draw support.

          Time for “The Donald” to read up on how Jimmy Carter or George HW Bush left office after they failed to get re-elected. He’s been reading too many Grover Cleveland biographies I think.

          • naw… if his supporters had not ransacked the Capitol, we’d just be putting up with a couple more weeks of what we’ve been putting up with all along.

            If he is “unhinged”, he’s been that way for awhile… A few months back Hannity was heard to say he was batcrap crazy.

            ” ‘If you were hearing what I’m hearing, you’d be vaping too’: Sean Hannity privately called Trump ‘bats— crazy,’ according to a new book” Aug 20 2020

            https://www.businessinsider.com/sean-hannity-trump-crazy-vaping-stelter-fox-news-book-2020-8

    • One constitutional crisis at a time, V.N. Let’s make sure Trump exits the White House. Then we can turn our attention to Hunter Biden, the Chicoms and Joe Biden’s extraordinarily bad judgment.

      • Yes indeed.. Won’t be long at all before Biden sends Antifa to ransack Congress… 😉

      • The Dems have NEVER EVER cleaned the garbage out of their homes. Ever. It will get worse – the corruption, stupidity, etc. Look at California with Newsom.

      • If Joe Biden keeps up his today’s ugly bigoted speech, we are going to have civil war on our hands before Biden’s done.

      • Biden has already popped off with something stupid. “No one can tell me that if it had been a group of Black Lives Matter protesting yesterday they wouldn’t have been treated very, very differently than the mob of thugs that stormed the Capitol.” Uhhhh …. Uncle Joe – the police shot one member of the mob dead yesterday. Want to bet that she was unarmed? I can’t recall the police shooting BLM protesters dead. Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t remember it.

        As for Batty Joe’s Granddaughter looking for the “rows of soldiers” – Mayor Bowser activated the DC National Guard before two days before the riot. DoD approved a 300 person squad of national guardsmen. The entire protest was aimed at the Capitol where the electoral vote was being counted. Where were the 300 DC National Guardsmen?

        In fairness, I don’t know what the hell the Capitol Police were doing. I read their chief resigned today.

        • Well folks are right. A lot of folks did not vote for Biden – they voted against Trump – that’s how he lost the battleground states as well as States like Arizona and Georgia.

          People going to civil war over Biden’s mouth will likely end up in prison, I suspect.

        • David McAtee*, Jorge Gomez, Sean Monterrosa are the ones that I can think of off the top of my head. Sarah Grossman. But for the grace of God Justin Howell would be among their ranks.

          To Biden’s larger point, no Black Lives Matter protest would have gotten to the sidewalk outside the Capitol much less into Congressional offices. We know this because they were cleared from a public space just so the president could go hold a Bible upside down.

        • DJ,

          You’re correct, Police never shot a single member of the protests. They roughed a few up, but never opened fire on them. She was unarmed and a military vet of 14 years. If you look at places which allow comments, you’ll find a vast swath of vile people cheering about her death. You’ll also find a vast swath of people dissecting her online personality justifying the killing. The very thing that they were against when the shoe was on the other foot.

          It’s disgusting, she lost her life. The CP who took her life will never be the same and I would say will lose his job. There action were wrong, but they did not require lethal force, especially given the precedent for overrunning Government buildings this past summer.

          • I would think in that situation whether you are a Trump supporter, or BLM or anyone – with a mob smashing windows and running amok that getting shot is a real possibility.

            If the BLM protestors in DC went to the Capitol and broke windows and invaded the interior of the Capitol, would anyone be surprised at some being shot?

            Are we having trouble with apples to apples here?

          • “I would think in that situation whether you are a Trump supporter, or BLM or anyone – with a mob smashing windows and running amok that getting shot is a real possibility.”

            Interesting, as that didn’t occur all summer. However, I’m rather certain you opined that the less than lethal measures used there were too much.

            It’s called escalation of force.

            “If the BLM protestors in DC went to the Capitol and broke windows and invaded the interior of the Capitol, would anyone be surprised at some being shot?”

            The lit DC on fire and not a one was shot.

            You just parroted the line PE Biden made, it was stupid when he made it and and it’s stupid when you make it.

          • UpAgnstTheWall

            As has been established, people were shot and killed by the police during the BLM protests.

            What didn’t happen during any of these protests but did happen during this failed attempt at insurrection was a cop being beaten to death with a fire extinguisher.

          • “As has been established, people were shot and killed by the police during the BLM protests.”

            No, it hasn’t.

            The individuals you described were shot during the commission on crimes. The first David Actee being hit in a crossfire, he wasn’t targeted and killed by the Police.

            Learn what the word insurrection means, than apply is correctly.

            “What didn’t happen during any of these protests but did happen during this failed attempt at insurrection was a cop being beaten to death with a fire extinguisher.”

            Oh and don’t pretend you give a flying f’ about the cop who died as as a result of his injuries as you just slurred other cops above.

            Get an education.

            The only wall your against, is the one where facts dispute your inane fantasies.

          • UpAgnstTheWall

            Sean Monterrosa was on his knees raising his hands.

            Ashli Babbitt was trying to scramble through a broken window in the U.S. Capitol to prevent the House of Representatives from fulfilling their Constitutional duties and certifying the election of Joe Biden.

            And I’m not pretending to care or not care what happened to that Capitol Police officer, that’s not what this is about. Since everyone wants to compare the protests to this attempt at insurrection I was merely pointing out that none of those protests led to those involved bludgeoning a cop to death with a fire extinguisher.

          • “Sean Monterrosa was on his knees raising his hands.”

            He wasn’t protesting, he was at the scene of a looting. To which an officer fired at him because he was crouched and reaching to his waist band. Officer believed it was a firearm, they were incorrect. It was a hammer. If you’re going to make statements at least attempt to find the facts in evidence.

            “Ashli Babbitt was trying to scramble through a broken window in the U.S. Capitol to prevent the House of Representatives from fulfilling their Constitutional duties and certifying the election of Joe Biden.”

            There was no one in the room and there were SWAT members behind her. She was breaking and entering without a deadly weapon, therefore deadly force would not be authorized or required. Learn what escalation of force is, then comment.

            And I’m not pretending to care or not care what happened to that Capitol Police officer, that’s not what this is about. Since everyone wants to compare the protests to this attempt at insurrection I was merely pointing out that none of those protests led to those involved bludgeoning a cop to death with a fire extinguisher.”

            “And I’m not pretending to care or not care what happened to that Capitol Police officer”

            Exactly, you don’t care because it doesn’t fit your BS agenda driven by conspiracy theories and utter false information.

          • UpAgnstTheWall

            Members of Congress were sheltering in place in the House chambers.

            I know you want this all to be okay because you don’t want to think of yourself as a bad person. But this is not okay. These people mobbed the Capitol to stop the peaceful transition of power to a freely elected person. They beat a cop to death with a fire extinguisher.

            And you’re working overtime to favorably contrast them with someone killed on his knees because your identity is so wrapped up in your political affiliation you cannot bare the burden of how wrong all this is. The second those guys at the Bundy ranch were allowed to draw a line on law enforcement without immediate repercussions this was probably all but inevitable; it still didn’t need to happen and the sitting president didn’t need to encourage it and you don’t need to be in here defending it.

          • “Members of Congress were sheltering in place in the House chambers.”

            So that justifies deadly force?

            So in your mind that’s a capital offense and requires no “Due Process”. Got it, we know your opinion and thank God you wield no power.

            You’re disingenuous, it’s okay I understand that facts are hard for you. They don’t allow your narrative to exist.

  5. @LarrytheG – I see a pretty major difference between the Trump of a year ago and the Trump of now. I think something snapped as he got closer and closer to the election.

    A year ago I thought his tough attitude but limited violence approach to foreign policy was brilliant. The economy was humming. No COVID. then came 2020. I think the stress got to him.

    • I agree. I saw that in Trumps first Biden debate, a changed man, much depleted.

      • Yes, now that I think about it – that did seem like a turning point. I’m considerably younger than Trump and I can’t say that I could have gone through the 4 years he went through (especially 2020) and kept my ducks in a row.

    • DJ – from the get go – Trump would personally attack people and encouraged others to be loyal to him or face personal attacks and worse. Never-Trumpers like Lindsay Graham and Cruz just folded and one by one the rest of the GOP did. What “leader” gets loyalty this way?

      At any rate, that kind of thing was going on all 4 years and the last year running for office – he held rallies where what he said to his supporters – and on Twitter was really not that different than this last one.

      What changed was the ransacking of the Capitol.

      That horrified even some of his GOP supporters but again, not his base. They’re still with him … and they don’t think he has “degraded” at all – they thought his speech was terrific!

      • We’re just going to have to agree to disagree. He was a jerk but so was Lyndon Johnson and many others. Something changed recently. The more I think about it Reed is right. It became much more noticeable during that first debate.

  6. James Wyatt Whitehead V

    Gerald Ford was not a gifted orator. But his speech on August 9th, 1970 was the best tonic that could be administered on that fateful day. It was given only minutes after Nixon’s departure by helicopter. I don’t think we will have a Ford moment coming from either side of the aisle. Maybe we don’t deserve one.

    • Ha ha. I think you mean Aug 9, 1974. Knowing your understanding of history I can guarantee that was just a typo.

      I was 15 when he gave that speech. I don’t remember it. As a bit of a sports nut I was fascinated by Ford’s interest in athletics. While JFK was a touch football player at the Kennedy Compound Ford was an All-American at Michigan. He had the chance to go pro with Green Bay and Detroit but chose to attend law school at Yale, where he helped coach the football and boxing teams. As a side note, Obama once managed to bowl a 37 while president. Ford was also an excellent skier and a very good golfer. But he slipped coming down Air Force One’s gangway and was pilloried in the press as a klutz. From that point forward I knew you couldn’t trust the press. If they can lie about America’s most athletic president being a klutz … what else are they lying about?

      • James Wyatt Whitehead V

        Yeah I meant 1974. Getting used to a new laptop keyboard. Don’t forget Nixon played football too! 2nd stringer lineman. He was a bit small at Whittier College. Nixon was an avid bowler and had a secret one lane alley built in the White House basement complete with groovy wall paper. You can see the trickster in action at the 3:16 mark. It was Super 8 filmed by HR Haldeman.

      • Ford, more than any other president, was a devilish comic genius.
        “I’m Gerald Ford, and you’re not.” He was self-depreciating and quick witted — playing football without a helmet not withstanding.

        His skewering of Mitterrand was perfect and intentional. Pretty sure it was Mitterrand, maybe d’Estaing.

        For those who may not remember, the French prez was being trashed in the French press for an rumored affair with his secretary — a stunningly beautiful woman. It was hot topic in Paris.

        Ford goes to Paris and while making intros with the wives and entourages, the French president introduces his secretary and Ford quips “Trade you secretaries” right in front of the French press. Gasoline on the fire.

      • OTOH, Ford took it all in stride. He may not have liked the press making fun of his slip, but he was down with SNL doing it. Plus, his reputation as the deadliest golfer. He loved Chevy Chase’s impersonations, and was reputed to have watched the show every Saturday.

        Ford, unlike all others with the possible exception of Carter, was comfortable in his own skin.

        I wish he’d have been a two-term. Things would have been different, maybe not better. Some forces are just overwhelming. The hostage situation would have unfolded just as it did but on his watch, there still would have been an oil crisis, and Reagan would have never been president. A Democrat would have won in 80.

        So, all is right with the world.

  7. “A promise of a blanket pardon for all actions taken during his presidency would be compelling. Whether it’s exactly legal is a good question but back room deals get done all the time in Washington…”

    “Years of dragging him through various lawsuits of debatable merit and possibly criminal trials would prove nothing…”

    There’s that soft on crime, bleeding heart Republicanism I’ve come to know and not respect over the years. Laws and consequences are for the little people – important people shouldn’t be held accountable. Frank Wilhoit’s observation remains as correct as ever: “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”

    The white hegemony in this country can’t and won’t last forever. And there aren’t enough empty, square states to make the US an apartheid nation for any real length of time. One day it’ll be white people’s turn in the minority, and I doubt very much everyone else will forget how we acted and who we gave grace to when we had political power.

    • Leona Helmsley? Matha Stewart? There are exceptions and it’s obvious.

      • Fun fact: in the fallout of both the Great Depression and the 2008 Bubble Burst only one person each time went to prison and both were – by sheer coincidence I’m sure – Jewish!

        Pay no attention to the WASPs behind the desks.

        • Two went to jail in 2008. The one I saw was a black guy who lied about his income on a $300K mortgage in California. He didn’t fill it out, the mortgage company did, but he did admit that he knew they were inflating his assets. Think that could happen to der Trumpenfurher? Yeah, right.

  8. A Trump pardon has a couple of hurdles to overcome, specifically, who and what.

    If Trump pardons himself it’s a dead deal. It will be challenged and overturned. No way the SCOTUS lets it fly. No way they set precedent for god only knows what, right on up to crimes against humanity.

    Pence pardoning Trump stands a better chance but it better be specific. If its a blanket pardon — Cart Blanc (is cart feminine?) — it won’t fly. Merrick Garland or Congress will challenge it, and Biden won’t try to stop them. He can’t. The independent DoJ is his shtick. And it will be overturned. See last sentence previous paragraph.

    So it has to be Pence and it has to be specific. Trump cannot have specificity. It then opens him up to depositions for the next 40 years. It lists his crimes, implies his cohorts, and even if not challengeable legally will be investigative fodder for the NYT, WaPo forever. Plus, the State AGs will have a field day.

    And, there is one other fly in the ointment if Pence issues a pardon for specific crimes. It has to list them all to be effective. And here’s the rub. Trump is not JUST an American gangster. You could see a trip to the Netherlands in his future.

    PS I liked the Trump “hostage video” tonight.

  9. It has to be said.

    Poor John Ossoff.

    I mean it was a real Heidi Game for him. Down by 14 points at the 2-minute warning having trailed the November polls and *BAM* we cut away for regularly scheduled programming at the on-side kick.

    Poor bastard didn’t even get a flying banner at the bottom of the screen.

  10. WOW! The VMI ratline has NOTHING on the queue at the West Wing exit.

  11. So Trumps “base”, as well as his hard-core supporters in Congress are NOT the groups talking about his exit and the conditions for it.

    Basically, the people who supported him , some of his appointees and Congressional supporters – switched and I don’t think afterwards, they’re gonna go back and re-join his citizen base which will continue on and probably not dissapate.

    So, will they continye to be a force in the electorate – for instance, in rural Virginia and/or for avowed pro-Trump policians like Jordan of Ohio or Gomert of Texas and the rest of the “Freedom Caucus”?

    How much of Trump’s exit, for instance, would change support for Amanda Chase?

  12. Don, the WSJ called for Trump’s resignation, but did not mention any quid pro quo for a pardon.

    Trump will not resign. That would be too much in conflict with his character and mantra learned from his mentor, Roy Cohn–never apologize and never admit defeat.

    I agree with you on the danger, as I commented earlier. If I were in charge in Russia, China, Iran, or North Korea, I would be sorely tempted to take advantage of this lapse of leadership in the U.S.

    Finally, I find it amusing that, after frequently questioning Biden’s mental capacity, you admit that Trump seems to have gone around the bend.

    • re: ” Finally, I find it amusing that, after frequently questioning Biden’s mental capacity, you admit that Trump seems to have gone around the bend.”

      Oh, many Trumpsters have said many times that Biden is senile AND corrupt and Trump is not .. or at the least much better!

      I still say that Trump has been engaging in this kind of talk at his rallies all along… the main difference this time was that they were in DC and not miles away…

      The Trump supporters have said all along that this is Trump being Trump even as others said that kind of talk was dangerous – they were dismissed as far left folks. No more.

  13. re: ” You just parroted the line PE Biden made, it was stupid when he made it and and it’s stupid when you make it.”

    Nope.

    Did you see the show of police for BLM that Trump sent out BEFORE anything at all happened?

    And all during the day – NOTHING happened .

    At night, yes… anytime there is unrest – when night falls bad actors show up.

    The Capital mob was not at night. In fact, the Mayor actually did call a curfew because we know what happens at night no matter the “cause”.

    I think you’re still very much have apples to apples troubles here but it’s a common disease among folks like you these days.

    • Umm yeah, that’s exactly what you did.

      You’re not using logical, you’re moving goalposts and not addressing facts.

      “I think you’re still very much have apples to apples troubles here but it’s a common disease among folks like you these days.”

      Like me? Humm didn’t you say you were non-partisan yesterday and called out all sides. That certain isn’t evident here or nor has it ever been.

      • Nope.. To you guys, “moving goalposts” means I would not let you do oranges and apples even though that’s how you wanted to view it.

        Non-partisan – pure – no response to inane and just wrong-headed comments? 😉

        Pretty sure the personal attacks start with you.. and not just at me.

        • Moving the Goalposts

          “Description: Demanding from an opponent that he or she address more and more points after the initial counter-argument has been satisfied refusing to concede or accept the opponent’s argument.”

          That in a nutshell in every single comment you make following the initial exchange.

          • Yep , your opinion not mine and a typical strategy when called out for trying to limit a point and ignore others directly related.

            common complaint from some who play that game.

          • “LarrytheG | January 8, 2021 at 10:46 am |
            Yep , your opinion not mine and a typical strategy when called out for trying to limit a point and ignore others directly related.

            common complaint from some who play that game.”

            No, it’s an apt description of what you just did and is a logical fallacy.

            Instead of returning a response to which information is provided, from now on I’ll just tell you the logical fallacy you’re employing and move on to someone who want to have a serious discussion.

          • re: “Logical fallacy”

            the other favorite “go-to” for you?

            😉

            yepper

    • Here is an analysis from an independent site that bears out the disparate treatment of protests. https://www.propublica.org/article/capitol-rioters-planned-for-weeks-in-plain-sight-the-police-werent-ready

      • When the first line on an article states as follows:

        “Insurrectionists made no effort to hide their intentions, but law enforcement protecting Congress was caught flat-footed.”

        I call shenanigan’s on “independent” and the rest of the “data analysis” was just garbage.

        Take for instance the following:

        “The invasion of the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday was stoked in plain sight. For weeks, the far-right supporters of President Donald Trump railed on social media that the election had been stolen. They openly discussed the idea of violent protest on the day Congress met to certify the result.”

        Yes, they planned a protest for weeks, which is their 1st Amendment right. Unless those rights have changed since the BLM protests.

        The criminal activity that occurred was spontaneous not planned. (so much for investigative reporting)

        Lets move on to the disengenious part of the article:

        “On June 1, following a few days of mostly peaceful protests, the National Guard, the Secret Service and the U.S. Park Police fired tear gas and rubber bullets to disperse a nonviolent crowd in Lafayette Square outside the White House to allow Trump to pose with a Bible in front of a nearby church.”

        If you don’t see the glaring hypocrisy, there is no amount of truth that will allow you to inspect your own political party and leanings for faults.

        • re: ” The criminal activity that occurred was spontaneous not planned. (so much for investigative reporting)”

          So some of these guys did not post on social media ahead of the event their intentions?

          They did apparently and laid a path back to themselves for law enforcement.

          This one article, you can dismiss if you want but there are MANY article and MANY quotes from both Congressional GOP , Trumps own administration people AND publications like WSJ.

          You’re living in denial – as usual.

          • Coherent arguments please, if you cannot make them don’t post.

            Oh and moving the goalposts.

  14. This is all so surreal. Calling for resignation and impeachment 12 days before apparently leaving office. There is no logical answer for this. Nonsensical.

    You have a China-bought and compromised president-elect Biden, with a confirmed pedophile son, (gnews.org) a totally rigged and fraudulent election (all right here https://defendingtherepublic.org/) and the Leftist playing their historical playbooks – counting votes important not votes, propaganda, silencing the other party, ignoring facts and events that don’t fit their narrative, blame others for your failures, identity politics and call everyone a racist, calling to disarm the public, violent riots and destruction, defund the police, offer to pay for everything. Go ahead ask Venezuela how that worked out for them. (https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2019/07/_the_left_is_following_communisms_playbook_for_revolution_.html?fbclid=IwAR3A2GvCC91oprXSu060GS0ggyQnxqtqEGlbwlXAkwp2SWMNHl5-QlCURQI.).

    Then think of all the Left playbook with FDR (packing the court, threatening the Supreme Court, give subsidies and favors for votes, got ride of opponents by having them investigated by the IRS and other shenanigans.)

    So while you’re distracted with bs surrounding Trump, what about the Communist direction this country is taking? the takeover? You’re apparently not paying attention. they have infiltrated our universities and government.

    Look up The Great Reset, The New World Order, Agenda 2021, Agenda 2030, and what they have in store for us.
    It’s not pretty.

    • Repeating this baseless charge that Hunter Biden is a pedophile borders on defamation of character. (A Richmond judge recently sued a political candiate for calling him “racist” and the suit was recently settled.) This accusation against Biden surfaced on some anonymous site, with no evidence. Supposedly the infamous laptop had lots of child porn pictures. The owner of the computer repair shop at which this laptop was allegedly left said he saw no porn on the laptop. https://www.newsweek.com/hunter-biden-laptop-qanon-conspiracy-theories-2020-election-1540173

      The linked to website supposedly showing the “evidence” of election fraud is a joke. It lists the court filings of those claiming fraud. It does not list the respondent briefs nor the court decisions, all of which ruled against the claimants.

  15. Someone is breaking down your door and you have no idea if they are armed or not – and deadly force is a discussion?

    • Only if that someone is a patriot or a blm’er, well to a Republican.

      You can breeze back though posts and comments on this blog about gun control and I’ll wager they all break down to defending yourself… until now.

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