Muddled Thinking about School Absenteeism
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9 responses to “Muddled Thinking about School Absenteeism”
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Congrats to Butcher for drilling down to the school level. That sheds some important perspective on it.
and believe it or not – absenteeism is a problem in elementary school.. parents DO take their kids to Kings Dominion, and to grandmas and other places and some kids stay with different relatives when the family situation changes… so you need to see the data to know that it’s not just one’s preconceived (biased” views of what it is and is not.
The problem with data these days is that it’s a slice, a snapshot and can lead to wrong conclusions that appeal to one’s biases if one is not truly objective.
Conflating data is a huge issue these days.
People are not as interesting in truly understanding the data as they are in having the data confirm their own views.
I think the researchers are on the right track but they need to dig deeper like Butcher was doing and then look at the grades also because Elementary school is a bigger problem than some folks suspect and it’s in elementary school where kids are given the idea that if they don’t want to go to school – they can do other things – when the parents themselves are establishing that as the family habit that then continues for the rest of their schooling.
bad habits start early….
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Agreed. But as to “The problem with data these days is that it’s a slice, a snapshot and can lead to wrong conclusions that appeal to one’s biases if one is not truly objective” — the data itself can also be manipulated to produce conclusions that are not warranted — e.g., by arranging for potential low-scoring students to miss their SOL tests.
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there is a persistent theme here – in my view – to accuse low-income folks of character flaws that contribute to things like absenteeism… low scores.. etc…
I don’t think that’s particularly helpful in the discussions – even if it is true …. it does not get us to what we need to do to address the issue.
we do very much have multi-generational issues with some demographics with respect to access to a good education – as well as their own lack of initiative in pursuing it.
but it helps no one to continue to harp on their perceived shortcomings… as if “it’s their fault and nothing we can do about it”.
Some schools I know of – work very hard to institute a variety of events beyond the school day – to attract the parents and get them more involved in their child’s education – to include attendance.
it’s a tough job. Teachers are asked to prepare for these events and attend them – outside the regular school day – in the evenings.. after they’ve spent all day in school, are worn out and lose planning and grading time … to attend the events.
Perhaps other things should be considered and done – I’m all for it – but the continuing mantra that poor folks , bad parents and bad teachers are responsible for the “failure” is a meme that reveals (to me) more about the folks who promote the meme – than the kids themselves – who need whatever works to get them to attend school, learn, and grow up to get a job and not need entitlements.
it all makes perfect sense – unless one is bound and determined to make it a blame game.
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Gee, Larry, maybe nobody is to blame for failing schools.
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that’s sorta like saying ‘no one is the blame for highway congestion” or airline delays…. or bad cell phone reception, eh?
you guys just have a pathological urge to blame for whatever ills… eh?
we have problems… it’s not that we have nothing but failure… it’s sorta like blaming your body for the warts you don’t like.
buck bup bacon…. you’re supposed to get wiser as you age , you know… but I realize it’s kinda gone out of vogue these days…….
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problems like these are not just one cause and not just one to blame…
and it started with mom/dad and their mom/dad not getting an education and in turn gained no real innate appreciation of the value of education to pass on to their kids…either – it’s a cycle…. how do we break it?
and not just inner city… coal mines, manufacturing – even agriculture …. moonshine, drugs, disability and entitlements… prison… etc…
If mom/dad got a crappy education – why should we be surprised that son/daughter don’t see school as worth attending – either?
you want to find someone to blame for this?
what good is blame if …. we all stand to lose downstream with social and economic consequences for all of us?
blame gets us nowhere… and it actually impedes efforts to address it – and no – it’s not going to solved by some guy with a silver bullet idea…. or voucher schools…
every kid that can be kept in school.. every 1% we can improve on absenteeism… does count… and is worth the effort even if there are also continuing failures…
when I look at Butchers list I see a huge diversity in the numbers… If we did that same approach with schools in coal mining country what would we see? How about in Martinsville where manufacturing has declined?
Could we “map” across all these diverse geographic places – and see a common thread that closely correlates low income to absenteeism? Perhaps worth researching….
to this point – we’ve basically dropped this in the lap of the schools – by forcing them to report the data – transparency and accountability” … so blame can be affixed… mind you
so no wonder teachers and administrators don’t want any part of it… who would?
but a curious thing – if you look at Butchers list – does that mean there are a lot of “bad” teachers at some schools and “good” ones at others… and if you fired all those bad teachers -who would want to take their place unless they had no other options? And that’s the kind of replacement you’d be hiring?
doesn’t sound like a solution to me….
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If mom/dad got a crappy education – why should we be surprised that son/daughter don’t see school as worth attending – either?
Larry, many generations of Americans saw education as the path to upward mobility, encouraged their children to study hard, and made financial sacrifices to send their children to better schools/college. Americans who aspired for better things for their children came from all races, ethnicities and religions (although from some more than others, just take a look at Jews and Mormons). So, the answer is, we should be surprised — even condemning — of parents who care little about their children’s education. Your idea that people are just passive victims of social and economic forces, an idea shared by many, is immensely destructive.
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Jim – you are correct but have you thought that all parents were on the same timeline for that realization about the value of education?
For instance, do you think folks who were denied an education at the same time others were accorded it – would affect that timeline?
do you think “parents” in Virginia after the Civil War were accorded the same access to education for themselves then to pass that on to their kids?
Do you recall that many farmers demanded that their kids be “available” during harvest season?
No – I DON’T think anything PASSIVE at all.. I’m talking about generations of parents and when in those respective generations the “parents’ were introduced to getting a GOOD education.
You seem to think they all had the same opportunity and access and some just squandered it and it serves them right.
You have a gigantic blind spot on these kinds of issues… guy!
if the others are not your standard middle class on that standard middle-class generational timeline – it’s something wrong with them… and that folks who actually do recognize that are “apologizers for passivity..”.
geeze guy… I DO regret the hard edge of our conversations and wish I was more capable of softer dialogue at times… my apologies… I will try to do better.
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I hope others will jump in here — but I have to say, the contrast in your (LG’s and JB’s) comments is a terrific read. You do illustrate, very well I think, two quite different ways of looking at this issue!
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